[PP-discussions] Fwd: Re: [Bureau] [pp-leaders.discussion] Fwd: [pp-leaders] CoA complaint: motions relating to affiliation fees
Larose75
Larose75 at partipirate.org
Ven 19 Déc 16:35:45 CET 2014
international
bon ca chauffe un peu sur la ml pp international
pour ceux que ca interesse... (en attendant le retour de nos "délégués
internationaux" (j'ai pas tout compris sur qui représente le pp dans
tout ca pour l'instant))
-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: Re: [Bureau] [pp-leaders.discussion] Fwd: [pp-leaders] CoA
complaint: motions relating to affiliation fees
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2014 17:10:05 +0200
From: Vassilis Perantzakis <vaspervnp at yahoo.gr>
To: pp-leaders.discussion at lists.pp-international.net,
coa at pp-international.net
My question is on the minutes that seem to be partial. Is there perhaps
a recording of the GA 2014? Any more information around this?
/“Result: we will have fees Final result: There will be membership
fees, 1/10th of the original proposal, parties with less than 500
members can pay as much as they want (but a minimum of more than 0€),
there are no penalties for not paying, observer membership is also not
associated with any costs, the first fees are due for the next financial
year (which begins tomorrow)â€
/
As Brendan pointed out to me and as written in the complaint, these
decisions seems to be contrary to the Statues.
I also have a question on the way votes were counted at GA 2014
according to the 2/3 rule. Abstain votes were counted in the total of
votes to get a 2/3 vote, or was the rule not applied at all and simple
majority used?
I wait the rest of the members of the COA to voice their opinions and
questions with great interest.
Regards,
Vassilis Perantzakis
PPI COA
PP-GR
vaspervnp at yahoo.gr <mailto:vaspervnp at yahoo.gr>
00306931945371
*From:*pp-leaders.discussion
[mailto:pp-leaders.discussion-bounces at lists.pp-international.net] *On
Behalf Of *Josef Ohlsson Collentine
*Sent:* Friday, December 19, 2014 12:55 PM
*To:* pp-leaders.discussion at lists.pp-international.net
*Subject:* [pp-leaders.discussion] Fwd: [pp-leaders] CoA complaint:
motions relating to affiliation fees
Hi,
I can only see bad things coming from CoA dealing with it no matter what
they decide... We all know PPI statutes are a complete mess so leaning
on them as hard as has been done here is just abusing the current mess
PPI is in. The complaint might definitely hold true but what is
accomplished? Would encourage PPAU to withdraw this complaint for the
greater good of PPI.
What is the real motive for bringing this up now? Causing more internal
chaos within PPI? Avoiding PPAU fees?
Kindly,
Josef
*International Contact for PPSE*
Contact me for any questions/concerns or if you need to get hold of
someone in Piratpartiet or internationally.
/Other contact:/
mail: international at piratpartiet.se <mailto:international at piratpartiet.se>
Twitter: @collentine
Skype: josef.ohlsson.collentine (only important conversations)
Cel: +46 73 824 98 49 (text me, if urgent)
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: *Brendan Molloy* <brendan.molloy at pirateparty.org.au
<mailto:brendan.molloy at pirateparty.org.au>>
Date: Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 2:06 AM
Subject: [pp-leaders] CoA complaint: motions relating to affiliation fees
To: Court of Arbitration <coa at pp-international.net
<mailto:coa at pp-international.net>>
Cc: "pp-leaders at lists.pp-international.net
<mailto:pp-leaders at lists.pp-international.net>"
<pp-leaders at lists.pp-international.net
<mailto:pp-leaders at lists.pp-international.net>>
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
Dear Court of Arbitration,
Please accept our following complaint for consideration.
An HTML version of the complaint is available here:
https://gist.github.com/bbqsrc/fc7a05121272a23804f1/730b5ae96e1912ea52bbb3697084e27cc0157a26
Please acknowledge receipt of this email as soon as possible.
Thanks!
## Complaint
PPAU requests that the Court of Arbitration hears a challenge against
motions relating to affiliation fees at the 2014 General Assembly,
specifically due to recent minutes of the PPI Board indicating that
they are likely to move ahead with attempts to acquire fees from
members.
PPAU consents to abide by the decision of the Court of Arbitration.
## Challenge
This challenge relates to CoA powers [XIVa(3)(a), (b), and (e)][XIVa],
and relates to the functioning of the General Assembly and PPI Board.
### Validity of affiliation fee-related motions
The minutes in question can be found here:
http://wiki.pp-international.net/Minutes_of_GA_2014
As there are no titles in the minutes, we cannot link to the relevant
section.
Please search for the following to find it:
> delay or not 9.5 in favour, 12 opposed, 2 abstentions Result: we
> discuss the hight of the fees now
As the minutes are a complete mess, we have attempted to decipher as
best as possible what the actual proposals were to begin with, and what
the conclusion is.
PPAU would like to note for posterity that these minutes are not of the
quality expected of an international organisation and the members
should seriously consider ensuring that the quality of the minutes is
significantly improved in the future.
Based on our analysis we believe the events to be as follows:
* "Board MOP for Membership fees at PPI" begins
* Discussion occurs.
* A vote to delay voting and discussion does not carry.
* A vote on whether or not to discuss Gregory Engels' proposed
HDI-based fees or a "1/10 proposal", which seems to mean 10% of the
original HDI-based proposal.
* That vote results in a discussion of the 1/10 proposal.
* A motion by PPEE that parties with less than 500 members will choose
their own fees, seems to have carried but is not noted in the
minutes.
* A motion to have voluntary fees for all seem to not carry, not noted.
* A motion whether fees are wanted at all, based on the tenuous phrase
in brackets "based on what we decided for so far" carries with 55.8%
support (not including abstentions).
* The minutes then assert that what had been agreed to is as follows:
> There will be membership fees, 1/10th of the original proposal,
> parties with less than 500 members can pay as much as they want (but
> a minimum of more than 0€), there are no penalties for not paying,
> observer membership is also not associated with any costs, the first
> fees are due for the next financial year (which begins tomorrow)
PPAU fails to see how such a result could be derived as:
* No conclusive vote as to the mechanism for determining the fees was
carried, specifically no motion carried that meets the requirements
of [XVI(1) or (2)][XVI];
* A feelings-based motion on whether fees are wanted carries, but it
is a tenuous, meaningless motion, that is also not valid as per the
statutes due to [XI(2)][XI], which stipulates that annual affiliation
fee motions must meet a two-thirds threshold;
* PPEE's motion does not specify that the fees must be greater than 0,
and therefore the assertion is again false;
* Notwithstanding the above, due to no fee as per [XVI(1)][XVI] being
determined, PPEE's motion is therefore irrelevant for the time being;
* "No penalties" was not agreed to nor discussed, and is also false due
to [XI(5)][XI], which stipulates that failure to pay fees can result
in voting rights being suspended;
* No discussion or vote was taken regarding fees for observer members,
and therefore the tenuous assertion is without purpose or merit as
it bears no relevance to the discussion at hand; and
* No vote affirming the complex assertion being questioned here is
recorded within the minutes.
#### Relevant statutes:
> XI Voting
>
> [~snip~]
>
> (2) Decisions concerning the admission of new Members (section III.
> paragraph 4), the exclusion of Members (section VII, paragraph 2),
> the determination of the annual affiliation fee (section XVI,
> paragraph 1) and the amendment of this[sic] Statutes (section XX),
> shall be passed by a two thirds majority of the votes cast.
>
> [~snip~]
>
> XV. Funding
>
> Pirate Parties International expenditure shall be covered by:
>
> a) affiliation fees from the Ordinary Members parties and those with
> Observer status,
>
> [~snip~]
>
> XVI. Affiliation Fees
>
> (1) The amount of the fee is determined annually by the General
> Assembly.
>
> (2) The affiliation fees and contributions shall be fixed in
> relation to the finances and membership of parties.
[XI(2)][XI] clearly stipulates that motions relating to [XVI(1)][XVI]
must carry with a two-thirds majority of votes cast.
[XV(a)][XV] implies that observer members should be included in any
calculation of affiliation fees in [XVI][XVI].
[XVI][XVI] as a whole seems to imply that (1) should be a fixed number,
and that (2) should apply a formula to that number consistently in
relation to size and finances of a party, without exception.
### Suitability of PPI board accepting affiliation fees at this time
Recent minutes of the PPI board state that the board intends to soon
begin requesting membership fees, but these very same minutes put into
question whether or not the banking situation has been resolved
sufficiently to begin taking large amounts of money from around the
world.
Relevant URLs:
* http://wiki.pp-international.net/PPI_Minutes_2014-11-29#3_Short_Reports
* http://wiki.pp-international.net/PPI_Minutes_2014-12-09#3_Short_Reports
*
http://wiki.pp-international.net/PPI_Minutes_2014-12-09#7_Financial_Situation
*
http://wiki.pp-international.net/PPI_Minutes_2014-12-09#8_AOB_.28being_urgent.29
#### Relevant Statutes:
> XVII. Treasurer
>
> [~snip~]
>
> (3) The Board is responsible for the sound financial management of
> Pirate Parties International.
[XVII][XVII] is an odd place to put a requirement of the PPI board to
be sure, but it is a requirement of the statutes that the board soundly
manages the finances of PPI, and this has been put into question.
## Requests
We request that the Court of Arbitration does the following:
1. Immediately introduces an injunction against the PPI board regarding
requesting or accepting membership fees until this case is
concluded, as per the powers of [XIVa(1) and (3)(a)][XIVa];
2. Makes a determination that "fixed in relation to the finances and
membership of parties" should be interpreted to mean a consistently
applied formula for determining fees based on that criteria, without
exception;
3. Makes a determination that the General Assembly did not approve any
affiliation fee that would meet the requirements of [XVI(1)][XVI],
either due to lack of a motion meeting those requirements, or a
motion failing to carry due to the requirements of [XI(2)][XI];
4. Makes a determination that motions relating to affiliation fees must
meet all of the requirements of [XI(2)][XI],
[XVI(1) and XVI(2)][XVI];
5. Makes a determination as to whether or not [XVI][XVI] applies to
observer members, as [XV(a)][XV] seems to imply;
6. Makes a determination as to whether or not the current PPI board is
meeting the requirements of [XVII(3)][XVII], which is necessary for
the purpose of knowing whether it is safe to send affiliation fees
to the PPI board. Should the board be found to not be meeting these
requirements, they should be required to apply to the CoA for a
determination on whether they meet [XVII(3)][XVII] prior to
requesting any affiliation fees in the future, and;
7. Makes a determination that any attempt by the PPI board to accrue
affiliation fees to be without authority or basis until a future
General Assembly resolves otherwise.
[XI]: http://wiki.pp-international.net/Statutes#XI._Voting
[XIVa]: http://wiki.pp-international.net/Statutes#XIVa._Court_of_Arbitration
[XV]: http://wiki.pp-international.net/Statutes#XV._Funding
[XVI]: http://wiki.pp-international.net/Statutes#XVI._Affiliation_Fees
[XVII]: http://wiki.pp-international.net/Statutes#XVII._Treasurer
- --
Regards,
Brendan Molloy
President
Pirate Party Australia
M: +61 449 617 246
W: http://www.pirateparty.org.au
E: brendan.molloy at pirateparty.org.au
<mailto:brendan.molloy at pirateparty.org.au>
T: @piecritic
PGP: 5721 8A69 1828 21E6
- --
Pirate Party Australia is a political party based around the core tenets
of freedom of information and culture; civil and digital liberties;
privacy and anonymity; and government transparency.
Donate today! http://pirateparty.org.au/donate
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